How to upload recordings made outside of FourteenFish

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75 comments

  • Dr Eamon Al-Hadithi

    Any update on when we will be able to upload videos from external sources? I have quite a few videos made through iris connect that will need to be transferred over here and the more this feature is getting delayed the more anxious it is making me! Thanks

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  • Dr Sujatha Krishnaraj

    That is after consent-then identification,before moving to consultation

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  • Dr Sheraz Yasin

    In regards to consent could you confirm as above regarding demographics and introduction is that included in the consent time or not?  As different webinars are saying different things. As for non fourteen fish recordings, it would be difficult to not confirm consent without asking if your talking to the right patient first.  Also in terms of verbal consent for non fourteen fish recordings what would be adequate verbal consent, if the patient is aware the consultation is being recorded as reception informed them at booking, and you acknowledge at the start is that enough? With a follow up accurx message with a consent form where they reply back yes if they are still happy for the recording to be used, as you can take a screen shot of the accurx message. 

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  • Dr Thomas Kelly

    We would really appreciate an update regarding consent and uploading remote consultations. 

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  • Dr Ali Bakir

    Thank you Phil that's very helpful.

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  • Dr Sonakshi Khorana

    Hi, just wanted to check when the upload feature will become available.
    From reading above it looks like a wide range of formats will be accepted (I.e from Apple/android/mp3 etc), is that correct as I have a fair few recordings. Look forward to hearing from you. Thanks!

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  • Dr heidi carroll

    please can you supply an appropriate consent form for us to use - we've adapted the usual one to include an addendum that this video may be used for assesment as part of the MRCGP RCA but it would seem sensible to provide one standardised form for all to use to cover this? 

    thanks

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  • Dr Simon Smith

    Phil do you have an update please? The advice re. consent is all over the place currently and causing a lot of us anxiety with respect to consultations already concluded. Thanks

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  • Dr Thomas Kelly

    Hi I am a trainee in Gloucestershire and we have been sent an email from our deanery at 16:50 today advising that we only use 14 fish from now to record consultations. The email stated there were some potential data security issues with uploading from other platforms and they were working on this.

     

    I have been recording consultations with consent as advised by the college and 14 fish and reviewing these with my trainer. 

     

    I am very worried that 14 fish will now potentially on the opening day of the submission period change their platform so we are not able to upload our consultations that we have been recording.

     

    This situation is stressful enough without guidance changing the night before the opening date.

     

    Can you please give clarification and reassurance that we will be able to upload our recorded consultations to 14fish from other platforms?

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  • Phil Wilks

    Hi Ali. This policy has come from the college, but I will double check this with them tomorrow and mention the webinar you attended. Can you remember the date of the webinar?

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  • Dr Sujatha Krishnaraj

    Hi
    What is the guidance for patient identification process that is acceptable?is there a GDPR restriction?

    Is it acceptable to confirm before consultation about Patient’s full name,date of birth ,first line of address?

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  • Phil Wilks

    Luke Tognarelli – sorry for the delaying in replying. I have raised a support ticket for you so we can help with this.

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  • Dr Debjoy Mallik

    If consent for recording was obtained via Accu RX can this be uploaded as written evidence of consent? Accu RX printouts will not bear a signature of course

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  • Dr Safina Kausar

    I'm having the same problem. I recorded on iris connect, the video is a 'MOV file', when I upload the video it says its been uploaded but there is also a message saying 'processing failed' and I can't review the video. 

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  • Dr Simon Smith

    Is anyone from 14F looking at this? 

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  • Phil Wilks

    Thomas Kelly – We were aware that this was causing trainees stress and I'm very sorry that it's taken a while to get answers to what are fairly straightforward questions. Hopefully the comments on this page and the new help article above will address everything but please let us know if not.

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  • Phil Wilks

    Hi Thomas – Please could you forward that email to support@fourteenfish.com ? We may need to update our guidance.

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  • Dr Leeanne Minto

    Please could you confirm whether or not consent at the beginning of the consultation is sufficient. And if not will it be okay for me to the submit paper consent to confirm the patient is still happy to use the recording?

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  • Dr Sarah Faye Crisp

    Thank you for your swift and helpful replies Phil. 

    All eagerly awaiting the launch of the platform! 

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  • Dr Melvyn Adjei

    The original RCGP handbook says if recurring outside of fourteen fish, for verbal consent you must also offer right to withdraw consent after the consultation. On fourteen Fish however it just says verbal consent?

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  • Phil Wilks

    Hi Raghad – Consent evidence that is uploaded to our system has the same level of security as the consultation recording itself, so this would be covered by our data protection documentation at https://www.fourteenfish.com/datasecurityforpractices in the section "How will the recordings be stored?". We will update this documentation soon to make it clear that this also covers any attachments.

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  • Dr Simon Smith

    I also understood from one of the RCGP webinars that verbal consent recorded in the patient's medical notes or taken by reception staff and documented in the patient's medical notes was sufficient and all that was needed. Nothing was mentioned re. uploading forms. I have 2 or 3 good recordings done in this way. 

    Phil you mentioned you were going to check this - did you get an answer?

    Thanks

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  • Phil Wilks

    Mohammad Hussain – Phoning the patient and putting them on speaker is fine as long the assessor can hear and understand them on the recording. You might want to try a phone call using the built in phone call system on FourteenFish though as this would probably give you better quality. You can do this without a mobile phone signal as you can just use a landline.

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  • Dr Sarah Faye Crisp

    The original information from RCGP and reinforced by local deanery is that recordings will be able to be uploaded to the portal for use in the RCA from secure sources- such as IRIS connect which has been given to us to start work towards the exam. 

    Can we gain more clarification this will be the case as otherwise I have a lot of wasted time and effort on video recording- upon the advice of local deanery- if these cannot be used for submission.

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  • Dr Oluwatosin Abdulhakeem Folorunsho

    Hi Phil,

    If the consent was taken before the start of the audio consultation ( Not part of the recording) and you mentioned at the beginning of the recording "Verbal Consent Obtained", Would this be enough to Tick verbal consent box? Thank you.

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  • Dr Luke Tognarelli

    HI.

    I have done a lot of recordings outside of fourteen fish and up loaded to this platform. I have uploaded them and selected that there is verbal consent obtained in the video. 

    However I now believe that my verbal consent is not adequate enough to be accepted by the new college policy.

    Is there a way to edit current uploaded consultations so we can subsequently upload further evidence of written consent ? As I have deleted the recordings on my recording device and they only exist on this platform now.

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  • Phil Wilks

    Hi Sarah, thanks for your comment. We discussed this with the RCGP this morning. In a nutshell yes you will be able to use these recordings provided you can prove consent was obtained from the patient. We are going to update this page shortly. 

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  • Dr Sonakshi Khorana

    Hi Phil,

    Thanks for all the info. Could I please just confirm -
    If we are getting verbal consent for recordings made outside of fourteen fish before the 5th, is this appropriate?
    Name
    DOB
    Address
    Consent - “is it okay with you if our consultation is recorded for exam and training purposes today? If you do change your mind at the end please let me know”
    I just want to make sure this is appropriate as the RCA handbook does not really give an example of verbal consent and what it should contain. Thank you. Look forward to hearing from you.

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  • Phil Wilks

    In this case I would go with verbal consent, as that is perfectly adequate and then you don't need to attach any other documentation as the proof of consent is within the recording.

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  • Phil Wilks

    Sonakshi Khorana – The time taken for things like the patient connecting to the video call will be taken into account my the assessor, and the same goes for any time spent getting consent for recording from the patient. However, verifying the identity of the patient is part of "normal life" when performing a remote consultation so this would be included in the 10 minutes and you won't get an extra allowance for the time taken to check their identity. I should say that ultimately the RCGP are setting the rules here so it is best to check the RCGP website or contact their Exams team to be sure.

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